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Planning App: Trident Hotel (Crane Street/Park Row)

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by simon, Nov 14, 2013.

  1. simon Member

    While we all debate IKEA's prosal, just want to spread awareness of the current planning application for demolition of part of Crane Street and Trident Hall in Park Row to create a large hotel. Deadline for comments is DEC 3RD (there is a public notice on the mouth of Crane Street from Park Row). The link to the application on the council planning portal is below but - as it's notoriously unreliable - here are a few elevation pictures (it's stands behind the Trafalgar Tavern in the first elevation).
    The link to the application in full is here but if you can't open it (as many can't) you can email the case officer 'David.Gittens@royalgreenwich.gov.uk' and quote application Number: 13/2971/F.

    Not gonna hide my own feelings as a local resident; Trident Hall is a sad and neglected building and it's ripe for developement and I'm not against a modern design in principle but the demolition of part of the original Victorian terrace in Crane Street and the general massing/height of the 'boutique' hotel is just too big (it would be higher than the Trafalgar Tavern, viewable from the river, overshadown ORNC etc). Park row is a cul-de-sac and there is no parking provision; this would undoubtedly lead to congestion in what is an extremely restricted site and destroy the character of Crane Street.

    Whether you agree or not I would encourage everyone who loves Greenwich to put their thoughts forward; it's a really big application INSIDE the boundaries of both the World Heritage Site & East Greenwich Conservation Area.
  2. Mary Member

    Remember Peninsula Ward Councillors always grateful to be copied in to letters to Planners
    - we dont see them otherwise
  3. Paul T Member

    Thanks for posting those plans, Simon.

    It's important to note that the 'artist's rendering' artfully chooses the field of view so you can't see the extra storey, looking over the Trafalgar tavern.

    Simon's points, that the building will loom over both the Trafalgar Tavern and the ORNC are well-founded. It's worth adding that this will be even more noticeable at night-time when the whole building will be illuminated and dominate the view from the river.

    Just as outrageous is the proposal to demolish Victorian cottages which frame the Thames Walkway. Instead of an essentially Victorian cobbled alley, which leads to Trinity Hospital and Ballast Quay, one of the riverside's most beautiful walks, we would have a modern glass tunnel.

    The prospective developers seem to have employed a decent architect, but she is only a fig leaf for their sheer greed in wanting to create such a massive building. Rather than complaining once it's built, it's crucial we all object now!
  4. Nicholas Sack New Member

    I'm not averse to an impressive modern design, but am totally opposed to the partial destruction of Crane Street, which is a rare historical thoroughfare of great character. Surely this aspect of the plans for the hotel will not get past the drawing board?
  5. Robert Russell New Member

    Nicholas is completely right - this design is out of keeping with the other buildings along this section of the riverbank and it would not be appropriate for the external walls of the existing buildings to be removed. The new proposed hotel should work with the existing structure.
  6. Robert Russell New Member

    Incidentally, Mark Mirams appears to be the case officer and not David Gittens
  7. Olivia New Member

  8. If we want Greenwich to remain a tourist destination we had better start looking carefully at what we do to it. When taking friends down Crane Street I often remark on how sensitively the modern houses, with their porthole windows, have been designed to blend in with the older buildings. No one is saying this lane is of outstanding beauty, but it is part of what makes any 'Tourist attraction' appealing - a slightly unexpected byway. As for the actual glass-ridden frontage of the proposed building, words fail me that Park Row should be ruined by such an out-of-keeping design.
    Olivia likes this.
  9. SteveE New Member

    For this type of building, the design that the architect has come up with is pretty impressive and at least avoids falling into the trap of being just another generic glass box. That said, this looks like a classic case of right building, wrong location. The sheer scale and the way that it overshadows the Trafalgar Tavern when viewed from the river is just too imposing and will utterly change the character of the riverside. When lit up at night, it surely dominate this beautiful view as well as the view down to the river from the Observatory, like dropping a 100w light bulb into a field of candles. I'm less concerned about the frontage on Park Row given that any new development is likely to contrast substantial with it's surroundings - better a well designed, bold statement than a tepid, helf-hearted attempt to blend in.
  10. Geoff3 New Member

    Surely this building is pretty much the same planning spec as the new humongous University of Greenwich school of Architecture building in the town centre opposite St Alfege Church - the massing, height, traffic, world heritage and residential amenity issues in my view are no different, it got planning approval even with substantial objections. I would find it ironic if the University opposite the proposed new development object to this Planning application.
    As for the view from the river, I think the residents of Greenwich lost that battle when the council gave building consent for those hideous buildings in front of the Cutty Sark.
  11. Franklin Member

    It's also important to note that the elevations, 3D images and photo montages in the planning application and reproduced above are deeply misleading, as they show the Trafalgar Taven and 25-26 Park Vista having mansard roofs. The Trafalgar has half a mansard, on the Crane Street side, while 25-26 Park Row have no mansard.

    25-26 Park Row did get planning permission for a mansard back in 2006 but this will have lapsed by now - and I can't fidn any evidence that it has been renewed. The Trafalgar has planning permission for a full-width mansard but the owner (who is also the applicant for the Trident Hotel) has allowed the fabric of the building to deteriorate so badly that I think it highly unlikely that he's suddenly going to build the mansard there either.

    If the images were to show the real (as opposed to purely hypothetical) elevations of the buildings on either side of the proposed hotel, it would be even more grotesquely out of proportion to its surroundings.

    Finally, it is simply unacceptable to demolish two Victorian houses in a conservation area on the very boundary of the World Heritage Site, simply to be able to cram in more hotel rooms.
  12. Geoff3 New Member

    Seeing these new pics - I'm even more amazed how similar the building is to the new School of Architecture that is being built within the world heritage site in the town centre.
  13. Chris Member

    I thought that Greenwich Inc were behind this??

    Am I barking up the wrong tree here, or just barking?

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